Offensive System

ok, do you think you should have several differnt offences or have one offence and have different sets in that offence?

i.e
you may have a 3 out 2 in motion, a 4 out 1 in motion, a zone offence and a 1 - 4 high set

or a 4 out 1 in motion with 6 or 7 different variations of it

[Coachpete]

Depends on your personnel. I look at who I've got and what they can do. I love running motion, usually 4 out 1 in, but my team this year didn't come to grips with it. We are running a set transition offence. In the half court we are using 5 different sets. The players wanted structure.....so I've put it in for them.

[aussieBaller]

You need different offences depending on the team you come up against.

[Coachpete]

You need different offences depending on the team you come up against.

So you run a different offence every week??? Your players must be incredibly adaptive.

If you have an offence that works you can run it against anyone.

[MAIN_MAN]

I do not like to use my brain when I play so no more than 3-4 offensive sets will do me :wink:

Won't work though I'll just run to the corners, yell for the ball and shoot 8 - 12 3 pointers a game :wink:

[Ups]

We have 1 Main offence for man and then 2 different ones for zone D!

[aussieBaller]

You need different offences depending on the team you come up against.

So you run a different offence every week??? Your players must be incredibly adaptive.

If you have an offence that works you can run it against anyone.

No I don't but what i'm saying you need a few and run the ones that work against the team ur playing against ie. slow defensive bigs get the ball inside whereas good bigs u would want to exploit their guards.

We have 1 Main offence for man and then 2 different ones for zone D!

* i didnt jsut write that down*

:lol:

[Btdg]

I've been thinking about this a bit recently too. Many teams have had success using complete offencive systems; triangle, shuffle, and Princeton being 3 of the most notable. These offences describe players movement and rotations in all situations, and the set plays run as variations on a pattern or a theme. Baskets come from breaking down the defence within the system. Other teams just run a series of set plays, with no common theme, designed to create specific shots at certain times.

The offensive system style is good, but very coaching-intensive; and I'm not sure how much result comes from it. Especially in mens basketball, its nice to run a full offensive system that breaks teams down and creates easy points, but at the end of the day, most players can score pretty easily just by running very simple 'mini-plays'. I reckon you could get the same results just using pick-and-rolls, off-ball screens, isolations, backdoor cuts etc in a free-lance offence, if you have the right players. At NBA level, this is what they do a lot cos when you play every second day you don't get much time to work between games; so its just miniplays.

Systems seem to work best though, mainly as teaching mechanisms. Nothing teaches spacing better than the triangle offence. Nothing teaches players how to read their opponents and cut backdoor than Princeton, etc. Great for young players where winning is less important that development, and if you only play 1 game a week and have the time and resources to work at a system for results. If you are thinking short-term wins at elite level though, I reckon a few set plays designed to get your best players the ball in the right spots would work as well, if not better because you can tailor it to specific strengths (rather than developing players skills to fit the offence, if that makes sense).

[Wallitron]

Personnel is an important thing in the NBA. The triangle was so successful on superstar dominated teams because it gets everyone involved.

I'm having problems with my junior team current getting the ball out of the hands of 2 or 3 players. I'd love my team to be totally freelance passing motion offense, but it doesn't work if the players don't involve everyone. I've now moved to a few basic sets in hope that more structure will help them get it to the open people for easy shots.

[cammo]

Kick em in the nuts.

[Ups]

We have 1 Main offence for man and then 2 different ones for zone D!

* i didnt jsut write that down*

:lol:

:oops: :P

We have 1 Main offence for man and then 2 different ones for zone D!

* i didnt jsut write that down*

:lol:

:oops: :P

didn't matter anyway Ups, you guys swept us, although if you are going with the same stuff this year should be good with a guard stacked lineup!! Look forward to seeing how it goes :)

Been thinking about this now also..

I am thinking that each team should have 1 or more (depending of level, i.e my u14 rangers will have 1 of each, but a aba team would have more)

Motion Offence
Structured Offence
Quick Hitter(s)
Spread Offence

[Ups]

We have 1 Main offence for man and then 2 different ones for zone D!

* i didnt jsut write that down*

:lol:

:oops: :P

didn't matter anyway Ups, you guys swept us, although if you are going with the same stuff this year should be good with a guard stacked lineup!! Look forward to seeing how it goes :)

Been thinking about this now also..

I am thinking that each team should have 1 or more (depending of level, i.e my u14 rangers will have 1 of each, but a aba team would have more)

Motion Offence
Structured Offence
Quick Hitter(s)
Spread Offence

Sorry different stuff this year! :P

[fahootie]

we run an offence called 'chooks'.

[Clips]

Won't work though I'll just run to the corners, yell for the ball and shoot 8 - 12 3 pointers a game :wink:I didn't know Burce Bowen posted here :o :lol:


The domestic under 16s boys team I have at the moment are alot like phoenix. Undersized, but with a gun point who isnt the most athletic (but can shoot the lights out at least) and we just run alot. Most of our points come from either the fast break, long jumpers or 3's and the occaisional tip in by the big guy.

Only sets I have for these guys are 2 inbound plays, a swinger play and on defence 1-2-1-1 in the full and 3/4 court versions. Other than that the occaisional set that we have ran once or twice before, that needs to be drawn up to jog memories (not the brightest kids on the team)

[kecu]

i agree with main_man and the standing in the corner shooting 3 pointers!!! :P

4 OUT 1 IN, 4 OUT 1 IN, 4 OUT 1 IN!!!!!! i recon thats the best structure cos its easy to drive to the basket........

all you need is a man offence, a zone offence, a special offence (to spot up a player when needed) and a motion offence.................good luck getting your team to remember them all!!!

[coach_rachael]

I've been thinking about this a bit recently too. Many teams have had success using complete offencive systems; triangle, shuffle, and Princeton being 3 of the most notable. These offences describe players movement and rotations in all situations, and the set plays run as variations on a pattern or a theme. Baskets come from breaking down the defence within the system. Other teams just run a series of set plays, with no common theme, designed to create specific shots at certain times.

The offensive system style is good, but very coaching-intensive; and I'm not sure how much result comes from it. Especially in mens basketball, its nice to run a full offensive system that breaks teams down and creates easy points, but at the end of the day, most players can score pretty easily just by running very simple 'mini-plays'. I reckon you could get the same results just using pick-and-rolls, off-ball screens, isolations, backdoor cuts etc in a free-lance offence, if you have the right players. At NBA level, this is what they do a lot cos when you play every second day you don't get much time to work between games; so its just miniplays.

Systems seem to work best though, mainly as teaching mechanisms. Nothing teaches spacing better than the triangle offence. Nothing teaches players how to read their opponents and cut backdoor than Prin ceton, etc. Great for young players where winning is less important that development, and if you only play 1 game a week and have the time and resources to work at a system for results. If you are thinking short-term wins at elite level though, I reckon a few set plays designed to get your best players the ball in the right spots would work as well, if not better because you can tailor it to specific strengths (rather than developing players skills to fit the offence, if that makes sense).


i like offensive systems for the very fact that its less to learn, considering theres usually only 4 or 5 movements before it starts to repeat itself, and yes its very coaching intensive, the best way to do it would be to get an entire club to by into it, similar to tigers juniors, rather than having the kids learn a new offense each time the change coaches.

i run a variation of the shuffle against the man, a "3 out 2" in zone offense against the 2/3 zone, and a '4 out 1 in' zone offense against a 3/2 zone or a 1/3/1 zone.


the zone offences i run are reactionary.

i love the shuffle because it can utilize the strengths of "any" player, you just have to teach them were there opportunity's are gonna come from, and tats a massive point, too may coaches run offences and run sets, but are only teaching there players to move from spot A to spot B, and not exactly teaching them where they should be looking for there isolation, back cut, post up, flare 3 etc

if the players were really getting the knack of the offenses then i might start to throw in some baseline/sideline plays etc

[Wallitron]

[only teaching there players to move from spot A to spot B, and not exactly teaching them where they should be looking for there isolation, back cut, post up, flare 3 etc


I think the even harder part to teaching the options is the fact that many junior players don't have the skills to finish from each of those situations.

Lets just take the post as an example. How many of your players have a really strong post moves in each direction? How many can get off a confident shot one on one in the post against a decent defender?

Same goes for other options, should you back cut on the left if you can't hit the layup? What's the point of isolation if you can beat your player off the dribble?

Sometimes I think rep players get too much structure pumped into their individual game. How many rep players play pick up ball just for fun? Maybe some 3 on 3 to really work on their individual offensive skills, and continually break down their defender off the dribble, or in the post.

Do any associations encourage/organise this type of freelance practice for their rep players?

[only teaching there players to move from spot A to spot B, and not exactly teaching them where they should be looking for there isolation, back cut, post up, flare 3 etc


I think the even harder part to teaching the options is the fact that many junior players don't have the skills to finish from each of those situations.

Lets just take the post as an example. How many of your players have a really strong post moves in each direction? How many can get off a confident shot one on one in the post against a decent defender?

Same goes for other options, should you back cut on the left if you can't hit the layup? What's the point of isolation if you can beat your player off the dribble?

Sometimes I think rep players get too much structure pumped into their individual game. How many rep players play pick up ball just for fun? Maybe some 3 on 3 to really work on their individual offensive skills, and continually break down their defender off the dribble, or in the post.

Do any associations encourage/organise this type of freelance practice for their rep players?

we do alot of 3 on 3 work, it is one of the best and easiest ways to teach them how to make good decisons on the ball and to read play off the ball.

We play a very freelance Motion Offence, which is hard to get the players into the habit of penetrating, as most players have not been taught to take on the defence.

[Not Happy Henry]

Doesn't mattyer what group I have I always try to keep the offences simple. I like to let the players use an offence as a guide - if nothing else becomes available use the offence in its structure - down south we had a name for this called structured motion - a contradiction I agree.

This season I am using 3 to 4 different offences - however as most have said - depends on the cattle you have at the time.

[Hulk Hogan]

I was watching Coach Carter on Austar Digital the other day. His attitude towards offense was simple - Run the crap out of it and worry about sets etc later. That is an awesome attitude. If you have the right personal that is the best way to coach the game and play it

[coach_rachael]

[only teaching there players to move from spot A to spot B, and not exactly teaching them where they should be looking for there isolation, back cut, post up, flare 3 etc


I think the even harder part to teaching the options is the fact that many junior players don't have the skills to finish from each of those situations.

Lets just take the post as an example. How many of your players have a really strong post moves in each direction? How many can get off a confident shot one on one in the post against a decent defender?

Same goes for other options, should you back cut on the left if you can't hit the layup? What's the point of isolation if you can beat your player off the dribble?

Sometimes I think rep players get too much structure pumped into their individual game. How many rep players play pick up ball just for fun? Maybe some 3 on 3 to really work on their individual offensive skills, and continually break down their defender off the dribble, or in the post.

Do any associations encourage/organise this type of freelance practice for their rep players?

your point is obvious, but i dont want paul rees doing anything on offense, let alone taking iso's or looking for perimeter shots off screens.

the key is to get your players to look for/expose there strengths, within the offensive structure. and in turn, your offensive structure needs to expose the strengths and hide the weaknesses.

[coach_rachael]

I was watching Coach Carter on Austar Digital the other day. His attitude towards offense was simple - Run the crap out of it and worry about sets etc later. That is an awesome attitude. If you have the right personal that is the best way to coach the game and play it

yeah i like that.


but the truth is grand finals are won in the half court, teams go defensive/safe, you see alot more zone etc


go and check out a day of championship grand finals, and the majority of the teams that lose, can blame there offence breaking down, especially in the 3rd and 4th quarter when the start to get tired

[Hulk Hogan]

yeah i like that.


but the truth is grand finals are won in the half court, teams go defensive/safe, you see alot more zone etc


go and check out a day of championship grand finals, and the majority of the teams that lose, can blame there offence breaking down, especially in the 3rd and 4th quarter when the start to get tired

Well I coached a team to a state championship in Quensland 3 years ago by applying the run and gun principal. Yes we had great talent and good depth, but we won the cahmpionship by running and pressing all game. We played an agressive 2-3 Match Up zone on out of bounds and pressured the cap out of the ball in it.

I agree that most grand finals are won in the half court but if you have the right game style (e.g. Kentucky Wildcats in the early to mid 90's) you will get the job done

[coach_rachael]

yeah i like that.


but the truth is grand finals are won in the half court, teams go defensive/safe, you see alot more zone etc


go and check out a day of championship grand finals, and the majority of the teams that lose, can blame there offence breaking down, especially in the 3rd and 4th quarter when the start to get tired

Well I coached a team to a state championship in Quensland 3 years ago by applying the run and gun principal. Yes we had great talent and good depth, but we won the cahmpionship by running and pressing all game. We played an agressive 2-3 Match Up zone on out of bounds and pressured the cap out of the ball in it.

I agree that most grand finals are won in the half court but if you have the right game style (e.g. Kentucky Wildcats in the early to mid 90's) you will get the job done

it definately can be done with run and gun, however its very very important to have something to fall back on.

[West]

In regards to zone offences having 4 or 5 guys on a court who can shoot threes remains the best way to quickly remove the use of zone defences.

[Essen]

Basically we run a structured secondary break which is followed by quite a strict 3 out, 2 in motion offence. On top of that you have our 1 BOBs and 2 SOBs plays and zone offence (which to put it bluntly is just jacking up a bunch of treys). We do also have some quick hitters and some Reggie Miller style plays as well as some isolations and the good ole 1-4 Low.

it definately can be done with run and gun, however its very very important to have something to fall back on.

Agreed. If you come against a team that manages to slow you down and your players can't execute in a halfcourt chess-like match, you're effectively screwed.

[Hulk Hogan]

Essen wrote:

Basically we run a structured secondary break which is followed by quite a strict 3 out, 2 in motion offence. On top of that you have our 1 BOBs and 2 SOBs plays and zone offence (which to put it bluntly is just jacking up a bunch of treys). We do also have some quick hitters and some Reggie Miller style plays as well as some isolations and the good ole 1-4 Low

I saw a team win a state championship once running 80% of the old 1-4 low or as we call it 'Flat' plays. It was awful coaching from the opposition coach.